Watch VINCUE Accelerate LIVE: Gross Behaviors

Danny Zaslavsky:

My name is Danny Zaslavsky with Country Hill Motors in Kansas City and Managing Partner of Vincue. And I’m joined today with Joe Reck, and Joe’s with Vincue and he leads our performance team. So Joe, you want to share a little history about yourself?

Joe Reck:

Sure. No. Good afternoon. Again, my name’s Joe Reck. I’m the team lead for the performance side for Vincue. I’ve got over 30 years of history in the industry. Any where from retail wholesale parts, service, F&I sales management. So I feel like I’ve done about every position in the store and been around at least to pass my knowledge onto our dealers and assist.

Joe Reck:

And my staff, the performance managers here at Vincue, same thing. They have the similar experiences that I do to assist our clients.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Yeah. So today’s topic is gross behaviors and [Mike 00:01:12] and Joe and I were laughing the other day because there are gross behaviors that increase gross, right? And there are gross behaviors that are just gross. So as we delve into this subject, if you’re joining us on Facebook or if you’re joining us through Zoom, please, I encourage you to ask questions and we’ll try to get them answered. But if you have any questions that require more of a one-on-one conversation, Joe, you want to tell our folks how they can reach you or their Performance Manager?

Joe Reck:

Yeah, absolutely. Probably best way is through me. My email is Joe, just J-O-E@dealercue.com and feel free to give me a call, a text. 816-516-3655 is always the best way.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Look at that. Sharing your cell phone. Perfect. Cool. I like it.

Danny Zaslavsky:

So let’s get it on the subject. So gross behaviors. I think we’re not naive to the fact that things are changing out there. And one of the ways to shift power from big box retailers, big online retailers, right, to us on the ground who are playing that ground game, who are working to make sure to stay relevant years ago was the initial conversation of digital retailing, right? So how do we eliminate friction from a consumer’s buying experience? And today that friction exists for dealers on the acquisition side, right? And so for weeks now we’ve been talking about how to be innovative with vehicle acquisition, whether it be in your service drive, whether it be through email marketing, social media, whether it be through an outbound approach and going out and concurring that inventory through the third party vendor sites like Facebook, CarGurus. And we’ll touch on that a little bit, but there are gross behaviors that exist there, and there are gross behaviors that exist there.

Danny Zaslavsky:

So we invited Joe here, because he works with dealers across the country that are using our platform and have also come off of other platforms, right? With legacy patterns or legacy ways of doing things that I think today are being challenged. So I guess let’s start there. Joe, what’s some of the most common things that happen when somebody transitions over? And what patterns do you see that should need attention, right.

Joe Reck:

I think some of the things that we’re seeing is your building value in the vehicles and, far as descriptions, photos, pricing, inventory management. So once you’ve acquired the vehicles, getting them out there on the web and showing the information that we are marketing the vehicles correctly, and that’s one of our biggest hurdles with some of the dealers out there is just showing them properly, how to market and the things that they can do to change and bring value to those cars.

Danny Zaslavsky:

I love it. So let’s actually… I’m going to share my screen to here and let’s jump into that very conversation because I think that’s really relevant and really important. I know from experience that the sole mission and vision of Vincue is to bring together solutions that used to live independently like inventory management, market pricing, acquisition, these are all different logins that you’d have to go into, and today it all exists under one roof. So part of that psychology or part of that process is tracking that vehicle from the moment it’s acquired, right? So for instance, when we’re doing appraisals in the system and we’re looking at a particular vehicle, let’s look at this Jeep Wrangler. I know it because we just acquired it.

Danny Zaslavsky:

And so in this case, we can start from the appraisal, and once you land on an ACV and you know that this was a street purchase, right, we’re assigning where it’s coming from and we can see who the appraiser is. Then we can start assigning any visible recondition to that vehicle so that we can start building that vehicle file, okay? And you can see it tallies up here in the end of what we think that should be. And then you have defaults, whether it be trade wholesale, auction and so forth.

Danny Zaslavsky:

And then once that vehicle comes into inventory because it’s been acquired, let’s go over… And I want you to see because what we’re talking about today is an acronym we call HAV, or highest authentic value, because that’s the whole goal is to create that highest authentic value for the consumer so that they’re not just shopping on price, right Joe?

Joe Reck:

That’s correct.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Yeah. So this is my store. So let’s use this Audi as an example. So you can see this vehicle has six service records on it. We can see we’re priced three of eight on it. So we’re not the best price, we’re not the worst. Pay attention to see what my cost is, what my gross is, and my percent to market. So I’ve got a larger gross on this vehicle, still maintaining a low cost-to-market, low price-to-market. But when we jump into it… And we’ll look at it, both from the consumer side and from the dealer side, right away, we can see that reconditioning was applied to this vehicle. And so we can see how much was spent and we can push any of this directly out to the consumer. So you can put the retail value of that versus the internal value of that. You could save that and push it directly to the consumer through the VDP across all reconditioning items. That is super, super important because it’s one of the only ways you’re going to… Reconditioning is one of the only you’re going to separate this vehicle from another vehicle before we start looking at certification warranties or what we call DEI, dealer exclusive items, initiatives, incentives, whatever you’re doing at the store.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Joe, what do you see when dealers start behaving and treating their inventory in this manner versus working strictly on price and price-to-market, cost-to-market?

Joe Reck:

When they start using the tool, especially the reconditioning tool, and using this and actually sending it out to your descriptions, individuals are definitely more likely to reach out when they see that some of these things have been completed or done. New tires, new brakes, that is a big piece of the puzzle adding that into your descriptions. That is so important far as building your descriptions and understanding that when people are out there searching for specific vehicles, the consumers types in and Googles, “I’m looking for,” this is Audi, “2018 Audi S3,” whatever it may be, “With black interior,” that has certain options. We want to make sure that your vehicle populates, and that’s where it comes in to moving to that next step and putting these items and then going over to the description building and adding those key features and options in there. So your vehicle populates when someone searches it.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Yeah. So we’re talking about… And the only way I can describe it, right, is gross behavior versus gross behavior, right? So gross behavior for those of you listening, just audio, I’m going to try to inflect. So I’m talking about money versus a gross behavior that you should change. So anything that you can communicate to a consumer that increases the value of the car, reconditioning is one of those areas, it’s really important. And we can begin to talk about ingesting that data either through a DMS or we can do it manually through a system. And all of that is then also visible directly, if you have your sales team using Vincue on their phones, we have a salesperson’s view of that. So they can get basic information on the vehicle, including recon so that they can share that with the consumer.

Danny Zaslavsky:

The other thing to consider, for those of you that work with Jasen Rice and Lotpop and Lotscore, this is where we start having the conversation around acquisition and where you are light or heavy in a segment, market, price range, and what your ROI is relative to your holding cost.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Because for those of us with the floor plan, holding cost is a real thing, and holding cost doesn’t just take into consideration the floor plan fees, right, but all the fees that are related to that parking spot that vehicle is sitting in. And so we may think we’re making a bunch of profit, but after that car’s been sitting for a long time, that profit gets diminished by holding costs. So those kinds of gross behaviors are important to recognize, and we believe that it begins with the appraisal and flows all the way to the sale.

Danny Zaslavsky:

So speaking of appraisal, Joe, can we speak about a little bit when a dealer is appraising in our system for the first time versus coming off of another system? What are some of differentiators in the way that we appraise that increased gross in turn relative to what they’re used to?

Joe Reck:

Right. I think one of the biggest thing of course, that as I look at our tool, definitely here in the 21st century, everything that stands out in the data that we give you, we give you a lot of data. This is true live market data. The thing that stands out with us is that we are going to rule out, immediately, those vehicles that do not make sense to include in your comparables. Mileage, mileage is a big thing. We’ll have a vehicle that might have 30,000 miles on it. Is that something we really want to compare against something that’s for sale out there that has 150,000 miles? No, probably not. Are you able to bring it in? Sure, we can if we need to. But more than likely it doesn’t make sense to use that as a comparable.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Yeah. So the way we teach at our store, and this is something that I encourage you, David Long, a friend of ours talked about. So if you have a sales tower of call it three managers, give them the same vehicle and have them appraise it and see where they land is a really good exercise. Do that across your organization? I think there’s a lot to learn there.

Danny Zaslavsky:

So what’s inherently different here in the system is Vincue is interested in giving you the most accurate comparables, not the most comparables. So if you notice below the black line here, we start excluding certain comps. But if you want to include them and add them to your or comp set, you simply click on it and it throws it up into the comp set so you can see there it is.

Danny Zaslavsky:

And the green ones are sold retail transactions. So we can see what they’re actually leaving the internet for. But when we appraise, and this is a gross behavior, right, a good positive thing, is we start with the comps. Because don’t want to be affecting cost-to-market or price-to-market without agreeing that the comps are correct.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Now that’s on the retail side, right? You can do the same thing on the wholesale side. So on the wholesale side, if you look here in the bottom right hand corner, you can create your own auction report by not just clicking MMR, but by also clicking OVE, Odessa, auction edge, whatever auctions you guys are using, and creating your own auction report by choosing four, five, or 10, whatever you want, of the most accurate comparables so you can see really where it lands based on grade, look, mileage, all those things, and you’re not just solely depending on the algorithm to spit it out.

Joe Reck:

Danny you-

Danny Zaslavsky:

Yeah, go ahead.

Joe Reck:

One of my favorite parts about the tool is the comparables, because like you said, this is real, live, accurate data. We want to give you the most accurate data, not the most comps. And the one thing that we do is that we are crawling actual dealer website… Or sorry, we’re getting this information from dealer websites. So we are not getting this from third parties. So there’s no third party listings in here, where sometimes that can skew the data because it can take them up to sometimes 3, 4, 5 days to remove a vehicle that might have sold yesterday or a week ago and it’s still sitting there in your comps when it’s not really accurate.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Yeah, absolutely. So I’m going to pause and just reset the room for a second. For those of you just joining us, we’re talking about gross behaviors, okay? Things that increase gross or things that take away from gross. And so you might be making a list in your head of what positive gross or negative gross behaviors you have going on at your store currently, and what you’re doing that might affect it. And some of it may have nothing to do with the stuff that you see on the screen, right? Some of it might be culture, and that’s not what we’re talking about today, but it’s something that we should all be thinking about, especially as we enter into a frictionless digital age of acquisition and sales.

Danny Zaslavsky:

So on the positive gross behavior side, I want to stay with the comps for a second, right? When we are appraising, traditionally, I’ve been taught that we look at a couple set of numbers. One is the books, the books are relevant mainly because that is what value is based off of. And so from a, “Is this a left handbook, a right handbook car? Is this going to be something that we can move quickly to a need buyer versus a want buyer?” Those are a lot of the reasons why I look at books. And books also… And especially today with the way the market is, you can go click on any one of these and go back into book dates also, and you can see the weekly or monthly books up to six months in the rears to see how the market is changing if you’re interested or in case you need to print one off as a step.

Danny Zaslavsky:

But on the comp side, too, especially for instance, this is a 16, so it doesn’t apply as much, but if were to be looking at like a ’19 or ’20, the ability to go into the trim and the year and add other levels of trim or other years. So for instance, if we’re looking at a ’20 and we want to see comps on 21s, because we know that incentives out there exist for those cars that dealers are trying to get off the lot. So we can make sure that we’re not… So we actually have a competitive vehicle. This is a way to do it. You can add other years and/or trim levels to the comp set and really narrow it down so that your consumer, who is looking for a deal, will make sure to see it.

Danny Zaslavsky:

On that point though, Joe and I had this conversation right before we got on this call, if you are purely chasing consumers through price-to-market and cost-to-market, I would strongly urge you to be careful because you’re effectively training your consumers to shop only on your clearance rack. No different than if I were to walk into a store and see a piece of merchandise that I want, knowing that if I wait a week, it’ll end up on the clearance table, then guess what? I’m going to be always going to the clearance room, and that’s not the way we want to treat our inventory. We want to treat it in a way that increases the value of the car. And so that’s where we get into inventory management.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Joe, do you have any anecdotes or examples of merchandising and how it affects a dealership’s culture, gross sales, churn, all that kind of stuff?

Joe Reck:

Yeah. When we’re looking at this page, immediately it catches my eye is the photos. Country Hill does a phenomenal job with not only just their overlays, but they’re banners, highlighting specific features or items for that particular unit. You can go to many dealership websites and look at their photos and how they’re taken, where they’re taken. Their cars are dirty, they’re disarrayed. We like to see consistency. We like to see nice, clear images, but we also like to point out those things that are highlights on those cars. Maybe on this car, leather, or maybe it’s a manual transmission, backup camera, if it’s specif wheels or model entertainment system. And when you highlight those things and you put those banners out there and those overlays, that makes your vehicle stand out. And as you can see, Vincue allows you to do that.

Joe Reck:

You can see we’ve got an overlay, we’ve got banners on each of the photos. We’ve got the ability to move them around and add different photos that maybe highlight warranties or history about the dealership location. That is the one thing… I’m a picture guy. I love to go out, and when I’m on a dealer’s website, I look at them and study and say, “You know what? You guys could be doing a better job.” And they’re like, “You know what, you’re right.” Because customers are going to come and land on that website. They’re going to see those pictures and they’re going to be immediately deterred if the car is dirty or it’s some weird angle that you can’t even really see a good image of the car.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Yeah. So let’s talk about that from a process perspective. So every dealership has slightly different process for this, all the way to big groups that have entire merchandising teams and marketing teams who are in alignment and their tracking is down to the attribution of churn. So as data hungry as you want to be here, or as loose as you want to be here with it, I want to give an example of a clean process.

Danny Zaslavsky:

So from the moment you appraise a vehicle, right, we’re measuring, number one days to market. So what’s your look to book on from appraisal to acquisition? Once it goes into acquisition, what’s your days to market through recon and up into merchandising? And then from merchandising to sale, what’s your average days on lot? Some guys and gals will measure their vehicle turn from the moment a check is written. Others will measure it based on when that vehicle goes online. So that is an important distinction though, when you’re looking at your inventory.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Secondly… We learned at Country Hill, and we’re certainly not alone. I can just speak to it easily because I know our process. We have a merchandising person that touches the vehicle before it goes online. So if you look here in Vincue, we can see these different buckets, so we can see what’s going on in the wholesale bucket. We can see what’s been recently acquired today. How many cars are sitting in hold, hold is service, or I call it purgatory. We need to get them out of there, and then go into NFR, not frontline ready, which is merchandising. And then it goes online. Now you can see, I don’t put cars online until they’re through merchandising. There are plenty of dealers out there that put vehicles online immediately with a quick picture of it, which you can do through the app. That really is a decision up to you and have much process you have relative to if a consumer calls and says, “Hey, I want to see that car. Are you pulling it out of service? Are you pulling it out of detail in order to show it?”

Danny Zaslavsky:

So once we get into it though, if you notice, within Vincue, gross behaviors, good behaviors, give you data that provides insights to change the behavior of the people you have at the store. So for instance, we can see this was a street purchase. We can see the gross attributed to that sale. We can then go into inventory, and in this case we’ve applied a sale pending overlay to it because this vehicle just sold. And so I’ll show you how that’s done, but if you go to our website and search for that car, it’s a one-to-one connection so let’s just put an Audi. And there it is. And you can see that vehicle already has a sale pending tag on it. So it alerts and creates urgency and says, “Hey, this one’s sold.”

Danny Zaslavsky:

And then also if you notice the notes from the team, isn’t just comments, but it’s indented. So you can actually read it. And I know that sounds novice, but it’s actually a really important piece of the VDP so that you’re not just reading a glob of information, but you’re reading real notes from the team, including reconditioning, including in some cases, a note from the previous owner that we capture when we buy directly from the public.

Danny Zaslavsky:

And so when we go into this sale banner tab, I can choose the overlay that we want in order to adjust whether it’s sale pending, sold fast, new arrival, whatever that is, because on our site, if you notice, you have the ability to reserve this vehicle and begin the digital acquisition route. And so it’s important that if you tag a car and say, “You know what? I’m going to give a deposit on it.” Then we can put a sale pending sign on it so that consumer can show all their friends, “Hey, see that one? That one’s mine. I’m going to have that car soon.” And it creates that urgency and excitement. Part of that positive, gross behavior.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Joe, you have anything to add to that, sir?

Joe Reck:

No. Right on the money. I love it.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Good. Good stuff. So as we move across the line here on gross behaviors, when you start thinking about the DEI… And DEI traditionally and business, it stands for diversity, equity and inclusion, which is so important. But I think that same mentality applies to inventory. Because dealers have a diverse inventory, especially today with franchises going outside of their limits and buying inventory that belongs on their sites. Traditionally they may not be buying as many Fords if they’re a Toyota store and so forth. But that equity is all the things that make that vehicle unique. So recon we talked about, but certification and applying a value to that certification, warranties and applying value to that warranty, where you bought it and how you bought it is equity. Did that vehicle come locally? Was it a trade? Was it somebody who owned it and you purchased it from them up the street? Auctions traditionally have a negative connotation to consumers and so highlighting the fact that it wasn’t an auction buy is important. And in any campaigns or incentives that you guys are doing, tying that to either the overlays here and then also tying them to the comments.

Danny Zaslavsky:

And be aware how this syndicates, right? Some of this syndicates to your website that gives the consumer way more information about the equity that you as a dealer provide. But then you lose some of that when it goes out to third parties, right? Autotraders of the world, CarGurus of the world, because the only place you really have to share that equity is on the overlays and on the Why Buys. So these are the Why Buys right here, right? You can add these Why Buys right here in the system, either mobilely or through a desktop and you can do it while you’re out on the lot, working and gathering this data that you think is going to share that equity with the consumer.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Joe? What are your thoughts, sir?

Joe Reck:

My thoughts are I go back to description building. I’d love for you to share this green real quick again. And you are highlighting the fact as one owner [inaudible 00:27:51] key. So if you could click your description button to the left there and then go up to features and options at the top center… Go over to the left. There you go. And then to your… Yep. Go up one more space, to your right. There’s the features and options tab, hit features.

Joe Reck:

So you can see here, we’ve done some presets for your store and you can do as many as you want, but just some quick ads. One owner, prior rental, non-smoker local trade, those are those things that you were talking about to highlight in your description. So if a consumer searching for a vehicle, looking for a non-smoker, one owner, new tires, and they search for an Audi S3 with that, yours is going to populate if you put that in your description.

Joe Reck:

Close out of that and go up to… Oh, sorry. Click your Audi again. The European cars are a great example. We have an engineering package in our description building and it gives the ability… Yep, click options. There you go. And it shows you, especially with all those different packages that some of these manufacturers have. I have a lot of European experience with Audi and BMW over the years, and between S packages, RS packages on Audi, M packages, M Sport on BMWs. And even the Japanese stuff, what we are able to give you is all these different packages that were available with those vehicles, and we’re able to give you the original MSRP. Now we’re not going to post the Ms MSRP out there, but we can give an added value and say, “This package was initially $2,600 when they built this car.” I love using that option when we’re building descriptions.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Yeah. And if you could tell, we have original window stickers and a lot of that is pulled directly from that. So you can see here here’s a 2016 Buick and here’s all the original options features and the original price. And in some cases we think gets even valuable to go in here and highlight all of this and pull it into the description and make any adjustments needed so that it’s really easily readable. But there’s a lot of different ways to provide that highest authentic value to the consumer and also create genuinely good SEO and SEM that will drive consumers back to your VDPs instead of just spending money on your brand name.

Danny Zaslavsky:

So we’re going to do one last reset. We’ve got about five to 10 minutes left before we’re going to finish up here, but today’s conversations with Joe Reck, who is head of our Performance Managers at VINCUE, and we’re talking about gross behaviors. So things that increase gross and things that lower gross. And so far, we’ve talked about appraising in the way that you do appraisals, right? Because that appraisal should follow into inventory, and then from inventory, through sales and all that rich data in between follows along with it. And then we also talked about building solid descriptions. And for those of you on Facebook, if you have a question, I’m watching the comments here. So if you do have a question, please chime in and we’re happy to speak to that. And then the other is that that dealer exclusive items or initiatives or incentives, anything that you’re doing that you want to communicate to the consumer so that we’re not just chasing price.

Danny Zaslavsky:

The last thing I want to talk about from a gross behavior is the idea of VIN specific targeted advertising. Because sometimes when we are appraising a vehicle, we always know, whether it be through market data, how long this vehicle traditionally lives online or through retail sales transaction data to know what the average price drop of a vehicle is like this, or what the average retail sales of a vehicle is like this. In order to cut that days-on-market, we can either be price competitive, right? Or we can also attract buyers from social media. And I recently did that with a couple unique cars we had, summit Prowler and other, but I want you to see it organically when we look at it from a total spend.

Danny Zaslavsky:

So here’s October for Country Home Motors. And if we just sort by our sold, what this is doing… And so we have inventory that we know needs additional eyeballs. And so we are effectively buying those eyeballs in order to sell a car. So for example, here’s a 2008 Ford Ranger, older vehicle, not that many searches on a car like this, but we do know that there are consumers looking for deals like this through social media. So this vehicle got a total of 410 VDP views, of which nearly 300 of them were brought to you by Vincue. And that cost $54. And that car is gone and sold. And so instead out of lowering that price, we can see that attribution here, and then we can also jump into the vehicle and see the leads attributed to that. So it’s a very powerful way when you start thinking about either targeting by specific VINs, or if you’re going to be doing campaigns such as SUVs, or trucks, or cars under a certain price range, or sports vehicles, or luxury vehicles, and working initiatives to move inventory. And spending you can see relatively very little dollar amounts per vehicle in order to move that car.

Joe Reck:

Yeah, that’s definitely a gross behavior, right? As I look at some of our stores that are using boost, what happens is they have these gross behaviors of just watching the cars, really not getting any traffic at all and they just keep dropping and dropping their prices. Instead, they could be monitoring their VDP views. Actually, you can set that up inside Vincue to see how many views that they’re getting. And maybe the traffic count as low. Like you said, that Ranger’s not going to get a lot of views, so you need to market it a little bit. And we do some VIN specific marketing, get it out there and spend $60, $100 to get it out there and sell. It’s a simple, easy method of doing it instead of just keep on dropping and dropping your pricing.

Danny Zaslavsky:

So here it is back to that Audi, just since we’re using the same vehicle file, as an example. Here’s the VDP views and here’s the leads attributed to it. And here they are, here’s all the consumers that we got to inquire about that vehicle. And what’s interesting here is, and I’m going to give a shout out to our friend, Jasen Rice at Lotscore. He has a system in place called Switch, which I think is pretty brilliant. So the idea of Switch is, on this part particular car, we’ve had 15 opportunities. Well only one of them bought the car. So that’s 14 opportunities here that are still looking for the car and so that idea is Switch.

Danny Zaslavsky:

So if [Kurt 00:36:02] or [Jason 00:36:03] or [Howard 00:36:04] or any of these people are still in the market for a vehicle, whether it be one like this, or this one, we have the opportunity to switch them to a different vehicle. And the question is, “What are you doing with those switch opportunities? How are you tracking them? How are you reaching out to them? What’s that process?” Because it’s easy to set tell your sales team, “Hey, pay attention to your switch leads,” but actually creating those leads in front of them, right? We respond to what’s in front of us, that is a sustainable way to scale switch opportunities and to increase the amount of conversions you get, versus just speaking to it, if that makes sense.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Okay, well, gosh, 45 minutes goes really, really fast. Joe, any closing thoughts for anybody listening on gross behaviors, either negative or positive?

Joe Reck:

Just that my team is here and willing and ready to help out to get rid of those gross behaviors and add more gross to the dealership.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Okay.

Joe Reck:

Yeah.

Danny Zaslavsky:

And then how do they get ahold of you if they don’t know how?

Joe Reck:

Best way to reach out is here’s my direct line 816-516-3655. And then you can always reach me via email joe@dealercue.com.

Danny Zaslavsky:

Cool. And I’m Danny. Danny@dealercue.com. If you go to Vincue.com>.. Actually, I want to share this one last thing with everybody. We’re trying to put very good content out there so that you can continue to learn, whether it be on the acquisition side, but you can go to the VINCUE Accelerate page right on our home screen. And if you haven’t joined, join. But then you can also see past shows that we’ve done, whether it be how to compel private sellers to sell to you, a day in the life of a VBC agent. But we’re posting these up here as a library so that you can go back and see them, learn from them, and then continue to level up your team. So with that, thank you, everybody who joined today and we look forward to connecting [inaudible 00:38:26].